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Join us at noon CT (1 p.m. ET/10 a.m. PT) on Tuesday, Jan. 25, for an hour-long chat about detoxing with the Tribune's health reporter Trine Tsouderos and panelist Stephen Barrett, M.D..

This chat will take a skeptical look at "detoxing"--the popular, age-old therapy for a wide range of ailments, from Alzheimer's disease to autism. What's the scientific evidence supporting the therapy? Are detoxing treatments like chelation safe? How reliable or interpretable is the lab testing done to measure metals and other chemicals in the body?

If you are unable to make the chat, or would like to send your question in advance, e-mail Trine Tsouderos at ttsouderos@tribune.com.

Health Chat: Detoxing

(01/25/2011)

  

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11:47

Chicago Tribune:  Thank you for joining our chat. We will start taking questions at noon. Please standby. Tuesday January 25, 2011 11:47 Chicago Tribune

12:01

Trine Tsouderos:  Thanks so much for coming to our chat on detoxing, an age-old practice. We're honored to have Dr. Stephen Barrett of Quackwatch. He's written quite a bit about detox treatments, and has posted essays by others on the topic too. So welcome! Let's go! Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:01 Trine Tsouderos

12:01

Trine Tsouderos:  So Dr. Barrett, how widespread is detoxing and why is it popular? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:01 Trine Tsouderos

12:03

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Many people are concerned that they are exposed to too many chemicals. There's a small realistic basis for concern, but it has been blown out of proportion by people who are (a) confused and/or (b) have something to sell. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:03 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:04

[Comment From ProHealthProHealth: ]  It is now the mainstream view that toxins in the environment are causing ASDs that have reached the epidemic level. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:04 ProHealth

12:05

[Comment From ProHealthProHealth: ]  “Future studies should examine for novel or increasing exposures to environmental factors from gestation to at least age 3 for our calculated 1988-1989 birth cohorts.” - EPA "As such exposure is potentially preventable, identification of relevant candidate environmental factors should be a research priority." - EPA http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/es902057k Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:05 ProHealth

12:05

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Absolutely not. There's no logical reason to believe that autism has a toxic basis. The percentage of doctors who believe that autism has a toxic basis is minuscule -- I would guess no more than 1 in 1000. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:05 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:06

Trine Tsouderos:  Hi ProHealth. I agree with Dr. Barrett. So far nobody knows what causes the majority of cases of autism, outside of some rare genetic disorders. Both of those citations indicate the EPA belives scientists should look into toxins, but it has not been accepted that it plays a role in the disorder yet. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:06 Trine Tsouderos

12:07

[Comment From TomTom: ]  Is there any benefit from detoxing? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:07 Tom

12:11

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Many methods are said to "detox" people. The vast majority make no sense. To answer more pointedly, I would need to know what methods someone has in mind. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:11 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:11

[Comment From ProHealthProHealth: ]  The cause is environmental. UC Davis Mind institute Professor Hertz-Picciotto "It's time to start looking for the environmental culprits responsible for the remarkable increase in the rate of autism in California," http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/article/19273 Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:11 ProHealth

12:12

Trine Tsouderos:  Again, though, Dr. Hertz-Picciotto is saying he thinks it is "time to start looking." That's a long way from saying, or proving, that environmental toxins play a role. There are lots of areas scientists are looking into, but they are not at a point where they can say this or that causes autism. Indeed, if we knew, there would be ways to prevent it, and new ways to treat it. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:12 Trine Tsouderos

12:13

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Defeat Autism Now! has several hundred doctors. The number of doctors in the US is probably about 800,000. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:13 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:13

[Comment From ProHealthProHealth: ]  Chelation is a viable FDA approved treatment for toxic radiation exposure (Chernobyl) and lead-poisoning sufferers, why isn’t it an acceptable treatment for ASDs. Especially when the science (74%) has shown there is a link between heavy metals and ASDs. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20628440 Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:13 ProHealth

12:14

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The vast majority of people who are chelated each year do not have a condition for which chelation is FDA-approved. Very few people, even with lead poisoning, need chelation. Quackwatch.org has a complete discussion of this subject. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:14 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:14

[Comment From EugeneEugene: ]  Autism Research Institute has a chelation protocol on their website for chelating children with autism. This group was started by Bernard Rimland who was a father of a child with autism. Are you saying that what Rimland has to say is Woo? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:14 Eugene

12:16

Trine Tsouderos:  Hi Eugene, there have been no clinical trials showing chelating children with autism is safe or effective. In fact, one was started, and abandoned out of concern that the children would be harmed. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:16 Trine Tsouderos

12:16

Trine Tsouderos:  We wrote about this extensively last year: www.chicagotribune.com/autism Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:16 Trine Tsouderos

12:16

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  I don't trust what the late Dr. Rimland advocated -- and I would suggest that people ignore what the Autism Research Institute says. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:16 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:17

[Comment From EugeneEugene: ]  The CDC has said there is no safe level of lead for children. If there is no safe level of lead for children then why would chelation not benefit children who have levels less than the action levels reccomended by some in the government. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:17 Eugene

12:17

Trine Tsouderos:  Hi Eugene, chelation is only recommended for children with high levels of lead. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:17 Trine Tsouderos

12:18

[Comment From MichelleMichelle: ]  Is detoxing ok for a person with Hypothyroid and what type of detox would be good and safe Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:18 Michelle

12:21

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Hypothyroidism is a condition in which the thyroid gland is not producing enough thyroid hormone. Proper diagnosis requires blood tests. If the underlying cause is amenable to medical treatment, it should be treated. If the hormone level can't be restored, hormone should be administered. I can't think of any type of detoxification that would help. Buy the way, most so-called detoxification products and procedures actually don't detoxify anything. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:21 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:22

[Comment From SuzanneSuzanne: ]  Would detoxing help someone who suffers from gout? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:22 Suzanne

12:24

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  No. Medical treatment of gout is usually effective, so that would be the best route to use to get help. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:24 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:24

[Comment From JennJenn: ]  I've had several knee surgeries and still have a lot of knee pain. Every morning I take several vitamins and either two tylenol or ibuprofen...The tylenol seems to work best. However, I know that it's harsh on my liver and have considered a liver detox...will it make a difference? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:24 Jenn

12:28

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  I do not believe that the various products purported to "detox" the liver actually do that. There's a common belief that the liver stores toxins. That's a misconception. It detoxified various substances so that they can be excrete by the kidneys. It does not generally store them. Most so-called liver detox products contain laxatives and fiber, neither of which will benefit the liver. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:28 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:29

[Comment From JillJill: ]  Do you suggest cleansing or detoxing the body of environmental toxins and the toxins associated with regular consumption of coffee, wine, soda and artificial sweetners? Is detox necessary to cleanse the body from the buildup of these daily toxins? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:29 Jill

12:33

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Regular consumption of the four beverages you mention does not cause any type of toxic buildup. Excessive amounts of caffeine and alcohol can be harmful. Large amounts of soda can unbalance diet if they contribute large amounts of sugar to the diet. But "detoxification" has no relevance to use of these beverages. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:33 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:33

[Comment From Jonathan StreeterJonathan Streeter: ]  Is there any research that gives a solid medical definition for what constitutes a "toxin"? I can't really picture how it would be safe to try and purge ones body of SOME substances without affecting one's entire physiology. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:33 Jonathan Streeter

12:36

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The scientific definition of toxin refers to specific types of toxic substances. The popular understanding of the term is much broader. Regardless you are correct that some "detoxification" products can cause trouble -- most often diarrhea. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:36 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:36

Trine Tsouderos:  Dr. Barrett: People talk about being 'heavy metal toxic' and point to lab tests as proof. Often these are called provoked heavy metal urine tests. What do you think of these? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:36 Trine Tsouderos

12:39

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  In provoked testing, a chelating agent is given and a urine specimen is obtained afterwards. Provocation artificially raises the test results. Some doctors and labs compare these levels to a "standard" for non-provoked testing. This is not legitimate because it makes people appear to have too much lead, mercury etc., when they actually do not. There's a detailed article about this at http://www.quackwatch.org/t Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:39 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:39

[Comment From Elias SaltzElias Saltz: ]  Can you describe and give a skeptical treatment of the plausibility of the claims of detox and what the science actually finds? Has proper research found any benefit whatsoever for any of the detoxification products or procedures? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:39 Elias Saltz

12:42

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The "detoxification" that all of the questions so far seem to be referring to is an array of practices based on quack notions that are not based upon the body of knowledge related to health, disease, and health care that has been widely accepted by the scientific community. I do not believe that any of them actually "detoxify." The danger of these practices depends upon how much they are used and whether they are substituted for necessary medical care. I have a summary article at http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/detox_overview.html Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:42 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:42

Trine Tsouderos:  Hi Elias: That's exactly the kind of question we should ask ourselves before we pay money and embark on any sort of treatment, whether it is detoxing or some other alternative therapy or, also importantly, mainstream treatments. What does the science say? Is there a good reason to think this works and is it worth the risk of taking whatever pill, supplement, etc.? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:42 Trine Tsouderos

12:43

[Comment From GuestGuest: ]  I have heard that foods containing gluten, as well as dairy products, cause a buildup of mucous in the digestive system. This in turn caused toxins that ordinarily leave our system through bodily functions to become trapped. Does this theory hold true? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:43 Guest

12:45

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The idea that the intestine traps toxins or builds up toxins is not valid. Some detoxification proponents claim that intestinal sluggishness causes intestinal contents to putrefy, toxins are absorbed, and chronic poisoning of the body results. This "autointoxication" theory was popular around the turn of the century but was abandoned by the scientific community during the 1930s. No such "toxins" have ever been found, and careful observations have shown that individuals in good health can vary greatly in bowel habits. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:45 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:45

Trine Tsouderos:  Right now, the gluten-free, casein-free diet is a very popular, but unproven, therapy for all kinds of ailments, from allergies to autism. It's part of the reason why we are seeing so many gluten-free products on store shelves these days. I was at Jewel (a grocery store) the other day and I was amazed by how many products were GF. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:45 Trine Tsouderos

12:46

[Comment From John D.John D.: ]  What are your thoughts on a Raw Food detox? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:46 John D.

12:47

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Raw (uncooked) foods do not detox anything. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:47 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:48

[Comment From Elias SaltzElias Saltz: ]  Dr Barrett, you stated, "The 'detoxification' that all of the questions so far seem to be referring to is an array of practices based on quack notions that are not based upon the body of knowledge related to health, disease, and health care that has been widely accepted by the scientific community." Other than going #1 and #2, is there anything that the medical community _does_ recommend that at least addresses some concept of "detoxification"? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:48 Elias Saltz

12:51

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The term "detoxification" used to be used to describe procedures for helping people withdraw from alcohol or drug addiction. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:51 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

12:51

[Comment From SandySandy: ]  Can you give us a simple short-term detox recipe to lose weight? Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:51 Sandy

12:54

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  There is no simple way to lose weight. Some misguided marketers claim that people become obese because they have trouble with digestion or because toxins accumulate in their body. Neither of these ideas makes sense -- so any detox strategy based on them would make no sense. Tuesday January 25, 2011 12:54 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

1:00	Trine Tsouderos:  Dr. Barrett: So what would you tell people wondering how to avoid pointless therapies? Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:00 Trine Tsouderos

1:02

Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  The Internet is filled with misguided advice about products and procedures. It's important to have the right level of skepticism and to get information from trustworthy sources. My Web sites debunk hundreds of dubious methods and identify over 500 sites that are trustworthy. Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:02 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

1:02	Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  We also have a free email newsletter. Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:02 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

1:03	Trine Tsouderos:  Here's Dr. Barrett's website where you can sign up for the free newsletter: www.quackwatch.com. Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:03 Trine Tsouderos

1:04	Trine Tsouderos:  Okay, thanks so much for joining us! Join us next week, Tuesday, Feb. 1, with my colleague Deb Shelton. The topic is kids and tobacco. Thanks again and stay warm! Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:04 Trine Tsouderos

1:05	Stephen Barrett, M.D.:  Thanks for having me. And thank your editor and publisher or the fact that your newspaper is one of the few papers that still provide high-quality investigative reporting. Tuesday January 25, 2011 1:05 Stephen Barrett, M.D.

1:05